Wednesday, June 13, 2007

Tremendous Response to F train petition!

264 signatures so far, and the petition has only been up for 24 hours. Many thanks to everybody who has helped support this initiative thus far:

The Gowanus Lounge
Second Avenue Subway Sagas

Ben over at SASS does a very detailed analysis of the proposal. I highly recommend reading it.

I've also been in touch with the editor over at the Brooklyn eagle, and reps from City Council Member Bill DeBlasio and Assemblywoman Joan Millman.

The MTA needs to know there is demand for this project. Sign the petition today!


Tom said...


I’m happy over the response you have received in regard to your petition. I’m not sure if I could sign it since, while I was born in Brooklyn, I do not now live in New York City. In any case following is information and ideas that the readers of your blog may or may not know about.

A survey of old subway maps and copies of maps indicate that express trains operated over the Bergen Street to Church Street subway (now F train) between 1948 and 1951, as well as between 1968 and 1974. During the 1968 to 1974 express service, provide by F trains ran during rush hours and local service was provided by GG trains. Express stations were at Bergen Street, Seventh Avenue and Church Street.

I see why riders from local stations north of Church Street would object to this system as they would not have a direct ride into Manhattan. However, the plan to have the V extended to Church Street as a local for the express F, would not face this same opposition. In fact many riders from above Church Street may prefer the proposed V extension with an F express as the train would be less crowded and they would be more likely to get a seat if the train started at Church Street. I could see that some riders may even prefer to take the V local even from Church Street in order to be guaranteed a seat instead of the F express.

One possible objection by these northern riders is that the V trains do not ran as frequently as the F (every 4 minutes for the F during rush hours opposed to every 6 minutes during rush hour for the V, according to the straphangers campaign). This may mean that in order for them to support this plan, the proposal would have to include more V trains (50% more), as well as an extension of the V line. Another issue would be where the G train would turn. Currently it appears that the G uses the express tracks between Smith Street and Fourth Avenue to reverse. This may not be possible with the F running on the express tracks. So, the G may have to turn at Church Street, if no changes to infrastructure are made. I see these points as issues that would have to be dealt with, but not things that would make the F express not achievable. Increasing the frequency of the V and extending the G may become benefits in their own right if the increase in New York City population and employment continue and if people continue to shift to subway in order to commute to work.

In regard to the work on the “Culver Viaduct” the elevated structure from the portal near Carroll Street to the portal near Fourth Avenue, I don’t understand why that work would interfere with the proposed V local and F express service as the express tracks over part of this viaduct “Why A Duck” are already being regularly used to turn G trains and that I would be surprised that much work is being done during rush hours. Of course no one is talking about implementing this plan tomorrow. Work could certainly start on the rest of the express tracks before 2012 and if the plan is approved and the start of this work was delayed until 2012, then it would take that much longer to implement the plan.


gary said...

Tom, thanks for the research. I believe there are other enhancements that can be made to the line over time, such as adding switches and ultimately, adding an express track all the way out to Coney Island.

The G is a wild card, we'll have to see what options there are with that line, the V local, and the F express.

tagray1 said...

Hello Friends,

Thank you for showing an interest in express service for the F line. The latest news from the MTA is that they are looking into how to do it and work around construction so we do not have to wait until 2013! I hope to have more information later this month. Until then, keep collecting signatures.

Tom Gray
District Director
City Council Member Bill de Blasio
(718) 854-9791
(718) 854-1146 Fax